Just like Afrocentrists have cockamamie theories, so do Eurocentrists. Some people believe that the first peoples of the Americas were the Solutreans, a stone age people from France and Spain who existed around 25 kya, and ended 16,500 ya. They would have had to cross 3000 miles of ice and water, does that seem possible 20 kya? Not at all.
The Solutrean Hypothesis first came about in the 30s by archaeologist Frank Hibben. He noted that the style of the spear tips the Solutreans used was like that of the Clovis culture in the Americas, who are the oldest culture on the continent. He said the tips bore an extremely strong resemblance to those from the Solutreans in Europe.
The points of the tips are different (diamond shaped, non-fluted vs concave bottoms, fluting). They also didn’t have boats to cross the ocean to reach the Americas.
From this Nature article, we can see that the genome of the Clovis people had direct ancestry to Native Americans:
An alternative, Solutrean, hypothesis posits that the Clovis predecessors emigrated from southwestern Europe during the Last Glacial Maximum4. Here we report the genome sequence of a male infant (Anzick-1) recovered from the Anzick burial site in western Montana. The human bones date to 10,705 ± 3514C years BP (approximately 12,707–12,556 calendar years BP) and were directly associated with Clovis tools. We sequenced the genome to an average depth of 14.4× and show that the gene flow from the Siberian Upper Palaeolithic Mal’ta population5 into Native American ancestors is also shared by the Anzick-1 individual and thus happened before 12,600 years BP.
Consistent with the population migration from Siberia into the Americas, as noted in this study. This study I will quote below also shows why some of the same alleles are found in both Europeans and Native Americans:
Y chromosomal DNA polymorphisms were used to investigate Pleistocene male migrations to the American continent. In a worldwide sample of 306 men, we obtained 32 haplotypes constructed with the variation found in 30 distinct polymorphic sites. The major Y haplotype present in most Native Americans was traced back to recent ancestors common with Siberians, namely, the Kets and Altaians from the Yenissey River Basin and Altai Mountains, respectively. Going further back, the next common ancestor gave rise also to Caucasoid Y chromosomes, probably from the central Eurasian region. This study, therefore, suggests a predominantly central Siberian origin for Native American paternal lineages for those who could have migrated to the Americas during the Upper Pleistocene.
And what do you know? There was this study proves the bolded text from the above study. That the Caucasoid Y chromosome comes from the central Eurasian region, which is where the Yamnaya came from, who populated Europe around 4500 years ago.
A study of the genetics of Kennewick man from Nature says:
We therefore conclude based on genetic comparisons that Kennewick Man shows continuity with Native North Americans over at least the last eight millennia.
That proves that Kennewick man was of Siberian origins, not European.
To round this up, some people like to say how some of the Natives have myths that a bearded white man came from across the Atlantic and gave them knowledge, who then left, promising to return. Then on the same day he promised he would return, was the day that Hernan Cortez landed at the Yucatan Penninsula. From their myths, they knew that the man was a god, because of his description.
People like to say that this myth proves Europeans crossing the ocean thousands of years ago to give knowledge to Native peoples of the Americas. Ridiculous, and here is why.
When the Aztec Empire fell, they needed a way to explain how their once great empire fell. So they then thought of the myth I described above. That the only way their civilization could have possibly fallen is only because of a god.
In conclusion, the Solutrean Hypothesis has no basis in genetics, paleoanthropology, and even basic common sense. Those who say that the Hypothesis is true are uneducated, and just like Afrocentrists, trying to push an untrue agenda.
Have you heard of the big bodies in Florida? I believe it’s called Windover or Windsor pond, this adds to the mystery.
The same conclusions from the mtDNA of the samples couldn’t be obtained again, so most likely, they were contaminated and that’s why some of the samples showed European markers.
Thank you for your reply, my background is far more into material culture so the DNA route is very interesting. I like many others will always wonder about certain things pertaining to the bog bodies in Florida because some things just don’t fit neatly. However DNA doesn’t lie and unless this is a group whose lineage is extinct, which is possible, then you must be correct. Have you ever looked into the Spanish accounts of fair skinned natives in the Carolina’s and Virginia? Modern native people have some very interesting takes on this you might find interesting. I never discount folklore totally because at times it turns out to be correct. I believe the Spanish called the folks they encountered the Duhare.
Interesting. Never heard this before. Apparently there are Spanish reports of the Irish settling the Americas. Researchers have no idea how, when or why the Irish settled the Americas.
Is there any more information on this that is verifiable and not just folklore?
I have a problem with folklore and myths when it comes to things like this but that’s relatively recent history. What else do you know about this?
I’ve seen the passage in the book mentioned in the text of that article but I don’t know of any other sources but perhaps one. It’s another book written in the 19th century. The only thing in the passage from the Spanish book that seemed off to me was fact that the chief lived in a stone house. Stone is very rare in the coastal plain of the Carolina’s and Georgia and I thought you only found small pieces but I was wrong. There is something called coquina stone that’s found in certain places that fits the bill here. It’s fairly soft and easy to work. I really don’t see anything impossible once that’s out of the way with the Spanish account. It’s also strange that it would be mentioned when this would give another country a claim to the land. That’s something that I can’t see the powers that be allowing unless it was true or at least appeared so. This would explain the light skinned Indians that other early accounts speak of in this area. Unfortunately I don’t know of any ancient stone ruins in the area but I will ask a few questions about it and see what I can turn up.
The other book mentioned above is called “the natural and aboriginal history of Tennessee” by John Haywood. Written in the early 19th century by a noted historian of the time it too makes some strange claims. Some of these like finding Roman coins and the like are very intriguing, if you can find this book online I think you’d find it interesting. It was written long before people thought like they do today. One thing in there I remember was about a conversation John Sevier (revolutionary war leader) had with a Cherokee chief which is documented in a letter from Sevier himself. The General was asking the old chief who built the stone ruins somewhere in the mountains and when. The chief said his people didn’t build those, yours did long ago. The called themselves the Welsh. Haywood was writing at a time when his sources could call him on his facts and they didn’t. Feel free to correspond by email and I’d be glad to flesh this out because several things in that book have intrigued me since a first read it a few years ago.
Nature actually came out with this article yesterday:
Underwater archaeologists unearth ancient butchering site: Tools and bones from Florida could put to rest the ‘Clovis-first’ theory of America’s colonization.
Any idea where this is?
Interesting. Do you know what that location is called? Know any more about this?
That article is very interesting, thank you for sending that. I’ve noticed that nobody ever wants to mention the actual Solutrean point found off the coast of Virginia with Mastadon bones by a trawler fishing for scallops about 1970. This point is supposed to be in a museum on the eastern shore but I’ve never seen it.
I don’t know anything precise about stone ruins but the area the Spanish were calling Duhare would be on the coastal border of the Carolina’s between Georgetown SC and Wilmington NC. It extended back a certain extent but I don’t know how far. Coquina stone can be found in these areas here and there as a rock outcrop.
As for the Welsh in the mountains I don’t have anything to go by except that letter from John Sevier and what’s written about it by John Haywood in his Natural and Aboriginal History of Tennessee.
I find all of this facinating and I wish I had more time to delve into and study what’s out there.
Go spam We Wuz Elsewhere.
The Solutrean hypothesis is garbage.
Jennifer Raff has a good article on it. Thanks for that second link.
I believe that admixture Genetiker found is related to your point about the siberians Natives branch off from sharing the same paternal ancestor as Bronze age nomads.
What’s funny in the inconsistency too. To explain it through travel routes and architecture they use the Canary Islanders as proof due to their own pyramids and frequency of blonde hair…even though genetically speaking ancient Canarians were closer to Med populations of NW Africa.
That could be a possibility. I need to look into this more as well. Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence. It also seems anyone can publish a paper nowadays. Also worth noting that it’s a preprint and hasn’t been peer reviewed.
There is not a single example of acceptable evidence that any civilizations lacking the technology with required infrastructure and navigational knowledge in Columbus’ era and beyond were capable of sailing a distance like the one between Africa and South America with the numbers required for a settler population.
I think all of these claims, taken on face value, are dumb. It’s like, even giving the SH everything possible, it still is highly unlikely they crossed the Atlantic or walked along the shore line.
Is there any type of anthropological evidence for the claim?
Things like this are really fantastical. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I don’t see extraordinary evidence.
Bog. Sorry for the typo.
Here’s a bunch of pages going We Wuz Injuns N Shieet by someone who got a paper on biorxiv